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Fast Backup

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Cain
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Fast Backup

Post by Cain »

My Server failed completely a couple of weeks back.....

Good news thanks to SBPro all my data files have been religiously backed up to an off-site NAS. I've rebuilt the server and am copying my data files back over now.

I'm reading and re-learning SBPro, and finding all sort of features I did not fully understand before. The more I learn and read the mosr amazing this program is.

I checked into Fast Backup (FB) today and for my off-site NAS via FTP it is a HUGE/Massive difference in how quickly my mirrored backups are completed. I have about 500GB of files to backup. Traditional mirror takes 35-45 minutes. FB takes about 1-5 minutes, if that.

I asked about FB in the past but I better understand it now so let me ask my question this way.

When I'm doing backups to an off-site NAS via FTP and nobody will ever access the NAS directly to change any of the backed up files, is FB as safe and as thorough as the normal mirror??

My understanding is FB is as good as mirror, assuming nothing on the destination drive is changed or altered, is this correct?
cliffhanger
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Re: Fast Backup

Post by cliffhanger »

You seem to be under the impression (at least, your post suggests) that you think Mirror and Fast Backup are mutually exclusive, whereas (with some caveats) both options can be used together. Fast Backup is a way to speed up the scan stage of the operation. Mirror is a setting that determines what action to suggest/take based on the information the scan discovered (i.e. whether to delete orphan files on Destination that are not present on Source). To put it succinctly, you can set a Fast Backup profile to Mirror files (or set a Mirror profile to use Fast Backup) in most cases, but the profile Type in the main UI will show 'Fast Backup' if you do (it won't say 'Fast Mirror'). You can of course add a ref to the mirroring action in the profile name (and/or, the profile Notes) if you want.

We already went though the fact (on another of your threads) that if you do want to use both Fast Backup & MIrroring at the same time in the same profile, you must be using the database method of Fast Backup for Mirroring (orphan-deletion) to actually work on all runs. While you could configure a profile to Mirror and use archival Fast Backup, it wouldn't actually work (delete orphans) except on a Rescan, as previously discussed. In any case, you must not try to use archival FB (or any other process that relies on archive bits on Source) in more than one profile/process, as each process will be resetting archive bits on Source that the other/s will be expecting to rely on. This is mentioned in the Help on Fast Backup settings page under Can I use Fast Backups on all profile types? section (also, more than a few times on this forum, IIRC)

Re 'cloud' (mentioned in another of your posts) versus Fast Backup: it's not clear if you've chosen a cloud service, but Fast Backup cannot currently be used with most consumer-grade Cloud services for technical reasons. If so, the entire Fast Backup settings page will be disabled (to stop you trying, with a message 'why not'). The fact you haven't queried this suggests you may be using a Cloud service that does support using Fast Backup, i.e. Amazon S3 or MS Azure (see link above and/or Help section re Fast Backup). Note that (TBOMK) this means you can use FB with Amazon S3, but not with Amazon Cloud Drive.
Cain
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Re: Fast Backup

Post by Cain »

Thank you!

"We already went though the fact (on another of your threads) that if you do want to use both Fast Backup & MIrroring at the same time in the same profile, you must be using the database method of Fast Backup for Mirroring (orphan-deletion) to actually work on all runs. ..."

I assume the "database method" is the default for FB?
cliffhanger
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Re: Fast Backup

Post by cliffhanger »

Yes - as already stated in that older thread of yours (Aug 2015) that I was referring to...

http://www.2brightsparks.com/bb/viewtop ... 468#p45469
cliffhanger wrote:If you click 'Perform a fast backup' (and not the alternate-option 'Perform a fast backup using the archive attribute') then you're opting for the default/traditional/original FB mode, which "remembers" (creates/maintains a database of) 'previous-state last run' to compare with 'Source-now' to figure out the differences between them.
Cain
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Re: Fast Backup

Post by Cain »

Cliff you are very helpful and amazingly knowledgeable about SyncBack. You often come across as hostile when answering questions, however, I doubt you intend to our that you realize it, but the written word can be harsh.

Folks would not ask a question here if they already knew the answer.

You often use different terminology to say the same thing, and Syncback's myriad of options while offering flexibility, can be confusing for the user (to put it mildly).

I'll try to avoid asking any more questions in this Forum the future. If I cannot figure it out, I'll switch to another product.
cliffhanger
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Re: Fast Backup

Post by cliffhanger »

Not intending to be hostile - and yes, it can be difficult to get 'tone' right using written word. Maybe I should use more smilies. Please also appreciate that not being able to successfully explain something can cause frustration on my part too (not necessarily with whoever's asking - could be with myself ;) ), which I guess might 'leak' into the phraseology.

I tend to use alternate terminology in case phrasing it in an alternate way might help the concept 'click' in the user's mind (especially if thinking of it - or having it explained to me - using different terminology helped me understand stuff better in the past). But I'll bear it in mind that might actually add to the confusion ( :?: figure out 'which applies in this case / for this user?')

I appreciate that people who ask usually don't know/understand, but if someone asks a question when they've already been given the answer previously, then I guess the options are
  • answer it again, but gently* point that out (maybe encourage them to re-read their own previous posts on same subject?)
  • answer it again, and not mention the fact (so no 'realisation can dawn')
  • respond and tell them that (without providing the answer again, or a link - yes. I've seen that on some forums...)
  • simply ignore it (which can offend anyway)
I tend to go for the first option, as it does actually (hopefully) provide an answer 'this time', but might encourage them to 'check their records first' next time (might be quicker for everyone?). IOW, not trying to offend, more to 'nudge'...

* I hope / to start with :)
Cain
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Re: Fast Backup

Post by Cain »

Thank you for the reply, I appreciate the response and I also understand your situation. Like I said you do an amazing job, and I know helping folks can be tiring and thankless at times!

Syncback Pro is an amazing piece of software, but its strength (flexibility, power and many options) can also be its Achilles heel! :mrgreen:

Amazingly enough I was unable to find a comprehensive help page for just SBPro, until this morning and it is incredibly helpful: http://www.2brightsparks.com/syncback/h ... upmenu.htm

One last thing, you listed four options for responding to a person's question where you believe they have already been given the answer. I can speak for myself, but if I keep asking, then I never understood the earlier answer. Pointing me to an earlier thread does me no good, because I never understood it back then. :wink: You might try to explain that you thought you had answered them earlier, and ask them a question.

"Cain, I see you're asking about Fast Backups again, I thought I had answered you earlier, but I'm assuming you didn't realize that Fast Backup is not exclusive to Mirror, and that it can be used on other backup options?? I'm also assuming you did not understand the various FB options?"

Just a thought.

FYI, I'm now understanding that the key to FastBackup is that it scans the destination drive once and assumes that it has not changed then when the source drives changes, and SB changes the destination drive FB/SBPro keeps track of those changes. Next time SB/FB will also assume the destination drive has not been altered by someone or something else.

I think the way Fast-Backup replaces the word Mirror on the profile made me think they were intertwined somehow.

Anyhow keep up your great work!!

-- John Cain
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