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Synchronizing 3 PCs

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nick.trusiewicz
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Synchronizing 3 PCs

Post by nick.trusiewicz »

I need to find a solution to this problem:

I want to be able to make changes in documents on one (of any of three) PCs to the other two. They are networked. When I connect to the other PCs, I want them to be updated (on my command) to the newest document structure, without having to copy absolutely everything.

I also want to remove any deleted files, and replace any older ones. I do not need to be prompted whether to copy newer files/folders over older ones, as the newer are ALWAYS those I want.

I sometime reorganize folders within folders to keep a reasonable number of folders in the parent directories. This means I cannot have a complete synchronization, because I will then have duplicate files and folders.

I am currently trying to remember what I have changed and manually copy the modifications. I sometimes completely delete or overwrite large folders and copy them from the source with YCopy. I also use a duplicate finder to keep track of duplicated files and folders. This is time-consuming, but faster than using the Windows shell to copy them. I have also used Q-Dir and muCommander (which has a great Folder Compare function (like good old Norton Commander), but cannot include subdirectories, as far as I can tell), to facilitate these operations. Some of these apps have filters I can use to exclude certain file types, which is also helpful.

I would like to be able to synchronize any changes that are the newest, preferably including the deleted/moved folders. I know that I can easily copy the moved folders along with the rest, but don’t want the duplications to remain.

I have used trial versions of Syncback SE, Acronis 2012, as well as Memeo, and cannot figure out how to configure them to do this. In fact, I lost almost a month’s worth of data (most of which I have recovered) with Memeo (the app I actually paid for!).

I do make regular backups, but not on a daily basis, and not when I am traveling.

I am using Windows 7 Pro, Windows 7 Home, and XP SP2. I have rearranged the folders in my profile in XP to reproduce the structure used in Win 7 to make it smoother. This means that the folders in XP (Pictures, Downloads, Music, etc.) have been removed from “My Documents” and placed in the main user profile. I deal with them separately.

Can you recommend a solution or partial solution to this predicament? If one of your apps will do this, please include instructions and/or or a sample file with the necessary configuration.

I am fairly expert in software, as I have used OSes from CP/M and AppleDOS, Including DOS from 3.3 to 6 and every version of Windows since 2.1, and have taught Windows since 3.1 and OS 7 through the earliest version of OSX.
Dave Wilkins
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Re: Synchronizing 3 PCs

Post by Dave Wilkins »

SyncBackSE (also the freeware & Pro versions) are all strictly two-sided, which means you need a schema to sync three devices, using profiles set to synchronise thus

A <> B
B <> C
C <> A

in order to ensure changes from C make it to A

If you want to use a central device X as a change medium (server, USB drive, whatever), you would need profiles to Sync as follows

A <> X
B <> X
C <> X
B <> X
A <> X

If you do not do this, new or changed files on/from C will not make it to A during that session (and so on). They may make it later, but there is no guarantee.

No files should be changed on any PC during this multi-sync period, or the results will be indeterminate.

No two (or more) copies of the same files can be worked on at the same time between syncs, without the regime eventually forcing a decision between the multiple versions which will ensue (meaning the changes in one or more will be lost)

SE & Pro have options in the Intelligent Synchronization settings page (Decisions-Files) to try and detect moved/renamed files. Be aware this involves hashing possible candidates, so can be very slow.

We don't provide sample profiles, sorry. We give pointers to what you may need to do/consider. We offer technical support, not consultancy. That said, any other user is welcome to chime in...
nick.trusiewicz
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Re: Synchronizing 3 PCs

Post by nick.trusiewicz »

Thank you, Dave.

I have no problem with buying SE, if it will make things simpler. I would, in fact, be using a single PC to propagate changes to the other two, but it won't always be the same one that serves as the source. I generally make changes on only one at a time, and infrequently do major reorganizations. Doing all three at once would be a welcome luxury in infrequent instances, though.

I don't think the time factor and having to leave the syncing folders would be a problem. If necessary, I could even work around it, placing new or changed items in temporary folders to later place in sync folders.

If I understand you, SE would not leave behind empty folders where the free version would? What exactly is "hashing" in this context, and why is it necessary? Is it to check the integrity of the moved/copied files on the same disk?

If I were to buy SE, would Support help me troubleshoot a setup like this? With respect to your math, is X to be substituted by A, B, or C, depending on the instance? I doubt I will be able to translate this into a set of profiles, but I will make some test folders and see what happens.

Thanks, Nick
Dave Wilkins
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Posts: 131
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 10:02 am

Re: Synchronizing 3 PCs

Post by Dave Wilkins »

Intelligent Synchronization (provided you use it) in the commercial versions is radically more powerful than the old 'dumb' Synchronize in the freeware. The latter has no 'memory', and cannot tell if a file 'only on X' is a new file on X or because the corresponding copy on Y has been deleted. You therefore need to tell it what to do if it finds a file on one side only - copy it or delete it (you cannot do both). In contrast, once you have run a Intelligent Synchronization once, it will have a database of 'previous state' on both sides, and can work that out for itself (so you can set separate rules for each situation). It can even work out if a file has changed on both sides since last run.

For this reason, it is wise not to Import old Sync profiles from the freeware, but to build them from scratch.

You can run all this on one PC, but at least one of the profiles should directly compare the other two (or, use a different regime, which will involve multiple runs of the same profile to make sure all changes propagate). This is assuming you may edit a file on any PC - say on PC-C in my examples. If you install SE on PC-A and only sync with the other two (A<>B & A<>C), changes on PC-C will not make it to PC-B unless you run A<>B again at the end

As per the contextual Help on the Decision-Files page (Intelligent Synchronization variant), the program will try to detect moved/renamed files. Notice it makes no claims re folders, though it usually works (but no guarantee). Files that have been edited and also renamed/moved will fail to be detected (the logic depends on confirming a potential rename/move candidate is the same content with the new location/name as it was with the old). Files that have been moved and renamed may not be detected. Moral: try and keep your moves & renames to a minimum - it will make your life simpler in the long run...

Bear in mind even if a rename/move is not successfully detected, a Intelligent Synchronization will copy files to where they are 'missing' and replicate apparent deletions/absences (c/o a manual move) anyway.

Hashing is - in this case - a process that calculates a hash value for the contents of two files and compares the resulting hash values to check the content of the two files is the same. Google for more background if you need it. A potential pair of rename/move candidates will not be treated as a rename/move unless hash values (thus, their contents) match exactly

As stated, X represents a central data repository (server, NAS, USB disk, etc). If you don't plan to use one, ignore that example.

It is probable that we cannot troubleshoot claims that 'it deleted the wrong file' (or similar) unless you can provide Explorer screenshots of the files and their properties before the run and a Support-Zip with debug-out of the run in question, As 'that ship has usually sailed' by then, it's usually impossible, not least because most descriptions of issues (imagined or otherwise) are insufficiently detailed or coherent. Remember that the settings mean what they say, and almost invariably the software does what you tell it to. What you need to avoid is the 'that may be what I said, it isn't what I meant' syndrome...
Dave Wilkins
2BrightSparks Staff
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Posts: 131
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 10:02 am

Re: Synchronizing 3 PCs

Post by Dave Wilkins »

PS: not sure why you seem to fixate on 'buying SyncBackSE'? You do not need to buy it to try it. The 'evaluation version' is in fact the same code (just has a time-limit - enter a serial in due course to prevent or reverse expiry). If you are near the end of an evaluation period already, uninstall & re-install to re-set it. You'll lose any existing profiles if you do, so do it before experimenting, if applicable.
nick.trusiewicz
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 7:12 pm

Re: Synchronizing 3 PCs

Post by nick.trusiewicz »

Thanks, Dave

I didn't know if I could reinstall or not--some companies put in safeguards to prevent reinstallation after the trial period. I've had it happen.

This is a good thing, and I can try my luck with it again.

Nick

PS: your timely answers are greatly appreciated.
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